Leave or Remain?

Tilly

Tilly

Well-Known Forumite
tek-monkey said:
I've posted this on FB before buggering off for the weekend, should make some interesting reading when back. But thought I'd post it here too in case anyone had any thoughts, this forum feels the polar opposite of my FB feed.




Looking at Johnsons quote from the other day:

Johnson has dubbed it the “surrender bill” and said it has scuppered his Brexit negotiations with the EU by removing the threat of leaving without a deal. On Thursday he said he would rather be “dead in a ditch” than delay Britain’s EU exit.

Why do people keep saying no deal is just leverage, why do you believe him, how thick are you? If you, some random person on the internet, know it is leverage, why do you think the EU does not? How can a bluff work when the other person knows you are bluffing? This isn't poker, both sides are well aware what cards the other holds, and no deal will hurt the UK much worse than the EU however you look at it.

Since getting into number 10 Johnson has not only failed to table any actual negotiations, he's reduced his negotiating staff by 75% and tried to ensure it can't even be discussed in Parliament. Does that sound like someone that wants a deal? As a dutch lawmaker put it recently:

“He’s totally unrealistic. He’s saying if you don’t do what I say, I’ll commit suicide. There are no negotiations with this government.”

He wants no deal to go through, yet so many keep bleating on that it's just leverage. Open your eyes and just admit it, you want no deal. Stop pretending it's some bargaining chip and just be honest with yourselves, just because Johnson lies to you doesn't mean you have to lie to yourselves.

Then tell me how no deal benefits us as a country? We have to deal with the EU, they make up half of our trade both in and out (but less than 10% of theirs). We have no choice but to make a deal at some point, but from outside that will take several years. What deal are we after once out? Why not try to get that now rather than ruin our economy for a few years first ensuring we are in a worse position than we are now? Don't forget we need to make trade deals with everyone else too, we're starting from scratch here, when we could start with 50% of it sorted.

If no deal is our ultimate leverage then using it ensures we have no leverage left. How will we strike a deal then?

I'm resigned to the fact we're leaving, but I can't get my head around the idea of destroying our country in the process. The whole no deal as leverage feels like we're admitting we actually have no real bargaining chip other than going home and taking our ball with us. But the EU already have other balls, and we need to find new people to play with.
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I think your most poignant remark is your resignation

Sad face
 
BobClay

BobClay

Well-Known Forumite
BobClay said:
Tagline:

"In Parliament, nobody can hear you scream !!! " :heyhey:
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I'm still sticking with my version …. :P

nostromoMP.jpg
 
Tilly

Tilly

Well-Known Forumite
:munch:

I think if you are suitably ensconced in a small Devon village with a full larder, or in a French or Irish city with good internet, or on a really remote Staffordshire farm with a few grand in cash hidden under the stairs, this whole thing could now be viewed as pure entertainment.


However, most good people still have to work, so this thing remains the most irresponsible act in living memory

Cameron started it , May added to it, Johnson, well, you're not really expecting another Conservative to make good, are you?

John Cooper Clarke for PM!
 
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tek-monkey

tek-monkey

wanna see my snake?
Apart from the food and water mine is always packed, and it actually does have some jerky and dried fruit in. I hike a lot, I could easily go off grid for a while, but I'd be more likely to barricade up my property and wait it out til they built a thunderdome in the market square.
 
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