Vista or XP

[Gramaisc]

I was still on 98 before I got this here Vista thing and it must say that it seems to be OK to me, but then I probably have very simple needs compared to most.

 

[db]

i think what would be useful is if people listed the things vista can do that xp can't.. as far as i'm aware, that list would be very very small (if not nonexistant), so it makes sense to stick with an older OS that has all the same features but has been tried and tested for 8 years..

i'm happy to be proved wrong, though.. it just seems to me that all the people who choose vista do so purely because it's "newer".. if there are things it can do (proper things, that one would use in the real world) that xp can't then please let me know!

 

[wmrcomputers]

but XP is still on the vast majority of machines out there, and it is obvious that microsoft is going to brush vista under the carpet in favour of windows 7..

Not so... XP's withdrawal is already in place and will have totally ceased within 12 months. They are planning the same 3 service packs of Vista as they had with XP before total withdrawal, which allowing for the time since Vista's release makes a good equal time run that XP was given.

CURIOSITY QUESTION - No offence intended, how much Vista experience have you had opportunity of? Are your thoughts based on how much you love XP, or actual bad experiences of Vista? If the latter, then was this pre SP1?

 

[wmrcomputers]

i think what would be useful is if people listed the things vista can do that xp can't.. as far as i'm aware, that list would be very very small (if not nonexistant), so it makes sense to stick with an older OS that has all the same features but has been tried and tested for 8 years..

i'm happy to be proved wrong, though.. it just seems to me that all the people who choose vista do so purely because it's "newer".. if there are things it can do (proper things, that one would use in the real world) that xp can't then please let me know!

One huge difference is UAC (user account control), which has immense security purposes. Vista also makes much better use of memory. (Example my Aspire One netbook runs BETTER with Vista Ultimate than it did on XP home)

 

[db]

but XP is still on the vast majority of machines out there, and it is obvious that microsoft is going to brush vista under the carpet in favour of windows 7..

Not so... XP's withdrawal is already in place and will have totally ceased within 12 months. They are planning the same 3 service packs of Vista as they had with XP before total withdrawal, which allowing for the time since Vista's release makes a good equal time run that XP was given.

microsoft's "withdrawal" of xp has been going on for years, but the general animosity of the corporate sector towards vista has meant that they have basically admitted this is an exercise in futility.. they have stated "categorically" that support will end on more than one occasion, and then reneged on this because it just isn't practical..

i worked for an IT reseller for 3 years, and we were in the top 10 HP resellers in the country so were reasonably big.. this was 2004-2007, when vista was just coming out.. time and time again we had to tell our customers that xp would be coming to the end of its life, and there would be absolutely no turning back.. then, of course, the story changed and it was "everybody back to xp!" lol..

they have now admitted defeat and the "extended support" for windows xp will continue until 2014 at the least!! see here:

http://support.microsoft.com/lifecycle/?C2=1173

CURIOSITY QUESTION - No offence intended, how much Vista experience have you had opportunity of? Are your thoughts based on how much you love XP, or actual bad experiences of Vista? If the latter, then was this pre SP1?

when i worked at fedex i was partly responsible for testing vista in anticipation of rolling it out across the whole operation, so used it quite a bit.. the one hurdle that we just couldn't get over when trying to justify it to management was: what does vista do that xp doesn't?

"immense security purposes" and "much better use of memory" are abstract reasons that are hard to prove and can't really be seen by the end user (especially when any memory benefits are eaten up by the extra bells and whistles).. there is nothing, that we could find, that actually screams "hey check out what i can do! upgrade now!!"..

for instance, compare all the things xp can do for you that previous incarnations of windows couldn't:

usb2.0 support
true plug & play
consumer adoption of ntfs
sata support
native cd/dvd burning
etc.

these are all things that the user will see, and will encourage them to migrate..

 

[shoes]

I find the GUI nicer and more intuitive. Not necessarily added functionality, but improvements to the current feature set. For example instead of the address bar in explorer you get this way of navigating around your pc:

Also, in general, Vista is very very fast, much more so than XP in my experience.

 

[db]

I find the GUI nicer and more intuitive. Not necessarily added functionality, but improvements to the current feature set. For example instead of the address bar in explorer you get this way of navigating around your pc:

see, this is good.. tangible benefits that you can see before your eyes!

yep, i like the breadcrumb trail feature.. you have very similar functionality in xp (just click the drop-down box in the explorer address bar and choose the parent dir you want) but the breadcrumb trail expands on this and is more intuitive..

 

[Wookie]

Wot dirtybobby sed.

**EDIT: That'll teach me not to get distracted when replying to a post, won't it? **

 

[shoes]

I will share one experience of Vista with you, networking is a ballache. I have a pretty good understanding of networking, although occasionally call on the expertise of Tek, however networking my vista machine to my housemate's xp machine has presented itself as an almost non starter. Despite the permissions being set up properly (by several people in the know) I am yet to achieve a decent file sharing structure and the PCs randomly see each other and then don't. I am not sure if you will experience similar difficulties vista to vista, but the networking options in vista i find confusing and irritating, whereas with XP networking is a doddle and does exactly what it says on the tin.

Now if you want to network Vista with a Mac.... well if anyone has successfully managed this please let me know because I was tearing my hair out before I gave gave up trying however I'm getting a little sick of transfering files via memory stick. Xp seems to suffer with the same affliction, so whilst this doesn't contribute towards the answer to the original question its a great bit of derailing

 

[db]

Now if you want to network Vista with a Mac.... well if anyone has successfully managed this please let me know

don't forget to let stephen fry know as well, who famously lost his rag recently over exactly the same thing..

Xp seems to suffer with the same affliction, so whilst this doesn't contribute towards the answer to the original question its a great bit of derailing

i've got 2 x XP PCs and an OS X 10.4 mac at home and they all share files just dandily..

how are you trying to access your PC from your mac? in the finder, just go to the "go" menu (i think) and there is an option to connect to a server (at the bottom).. in there just type:

smb://192.168.1.100 (obviously put in the IP of the PC you want to connect to)

this will then present you with a list of shares you can connect to.. if you want to browse the whole hard drive, just stick c$ on the end to go to the root of C: (i think this share is configured by windows by default, but if not just set up C$ on your PC before trying this)..

 

[shoes]

Normally in finder my housemate's XP machine appears under shared, however I cannot see my vista box. I will try what you have said above when i get home tonight and let you know how i get on - thanks for the info.

FWIW neither machine will see the mac, is there something i have to do to the mac to make it appear on the network?

 

[db]

Normally in finder my housemate's XP machine appears under shared, however I cannot see my vista box. I will try what you have said above when i get home tonight and let you know how i get on - thanks for the info.

FWIW neither machine will see the mac, is there something i have to do to the mac to make it appear on the network?

it won't just appear on the network, because it is not part of your workgroup.. to access your mac from your pc, you have to enable sharing on the mac for a start..

go to system preferences > internet & network > sharing and make sure windows file sharing is enabled under the services listed.. very helpfully, a message will then come up at the bottom telling you how to access your mac from a PC on the same network

 

[shoes]

Hmm well I haven't seen anything like that so I presume thats the vital step I have missed! I have enabled file sharing and networking, however nothing specific to windows. I can't remember exactly off the top of my head, and all this mac gubbins is still really new to me. I'll definitely have a crack at this tonight though - your help is much appreciated!

 

[db]

Hmm well I haven't seen anything like that so I presume thats the vital step I have missed! I have enabled file sharing and networking, however nothing specific to windows. I can't remember exactly off the top of my head, and all this mac gubbins is still really new to me. I'll definitely have a crack at this tonight though - your help is much appreciated!

yeah, i'm a mac n00b as well.. the only reason i got one was so i could educate myself as to how they work!

and, to get this thread back on track - vista is a bitch when it comes to networking, especially in a multiplatform environment..

XP - 1,000,000
Vista - nil point

actually, that's unfair - it scored a point for shoes' Explorer observation.. so, if you aren't going to network your machine, and love the "web 2.0" feel of breadcrumb-trail paths in explorer, install vista

 

[My Name is URL]

Right guys, I have decided to go for it for one reason and one reason only....

I have just wiped my machine completely and clean installed XP so all of my files are backed up elsewhere...

Its a ballache getting back to how my machine was before (minus the slowness) so I might as well give Vista a try and if its sh*t or slow with Vista on then I can just wipe it and go back to XP with no additional ballache to what I have to do anyway....

 

[wmrcomputers]

Right guys, I have decided to go for it for one reason and one reason only....

I have just wiped my machine completely and clean installed XP so all of my files are backed up elsewhere...

Its a ballache getting back to how my machine was before (minus the slowness) so I might as well give Vista a try and if its sh*t or slow with Vista on then I can just wipe it and go back to XP with no additional ballache to what I have to do anyway....

I personally don't think you'll regret it. I agree with what has been said about networking Vista to other PC's but if you dont intend to do this it's of no real concern to you.

Just to confirm to Shoes etc... Vista to Vista = no problem. I wouldn't look at this as a floor to Vista though, XP to XP is a doddle but to Mac I understand is more complicated etc. I think we just need to assume networking any different platforms together is a ballache.

I know about as much as I need to know about networking, but if we're honest it's pretty much a specialist subject anyway, and I think gk's original post was more about the performance of the Vista operating system in general. Based on his Spec I think Shoes & myself are in agreeance about the Vista option?

Glad you're giving it a try GK, and please do update us on your thoughts and opinions once you've had a few days to play around with it.

 

[db]

Just to confirm to Shoes etc... Vista to Vista = no problem. I wouldn't look at this as a floor to Vista though, XP to XP is a doddle but to Mac I understand is more complicated etc. I think we just need to assume networking any different platforms together is a ballache.

nah, see my other posts - XP to OS X (and vice versa) is a doddle.. vista, on the other hand, simply refuses to play ball, and has been the subject of a lot of bad press recently, not least because of stephen fry lol..

but yeah, i'm sure you'll get on just fine with vista gk.. if you just want to use your PC standalone, for everyday office tasks/internet/etc. then i can't imagine you'll have cause for concern..

 

[My Name is URL]

Well initial update:

Took a good few hours last night to install Vista and then do the various updates etc...

Initially once installed it was constantly showing my processor at 60% and my RAM at 55% even when not doing anything which was a bit worrying...

Then it downloaded all of the updates (72 I think and took a long time) and was much better.

Is now showing about 10 - 20% processor when doing nothing (in the foreground) and about 20% RAM usage....

Will compare speed as it beds in and I get all of my important software back on there...

 

[shoes]

I presume SP1 was part of these updates, I'd check though as its essential.

 

[My Name is URL]

Must just add....

I also use a netbook with XP on and used to have shared folders that I could access on my desktop from my netbook and viceversa..

If I lost this functionality then i'll be quite annoyed as i'll have to get off my ar$e to go upstairs, copy stuff on to a memory stick....