Stafford shops closing - Turning into a ghost town?

stoofer34

Well-Known Forumite
See, I've had it the other way around, family that visited from Pwllheli the other week thought our selection of shops was wonderful and we were really lucky -I think it depends on your original starting point.

Asda has killed Pwllheli

S
 

Miss Red

Well-Known Forumite
I agree with wormella.............it depends where you come from, a lot of staffodians do seem to be happy with their lot, you never miss what you have never had.
 

Miss Red

Well-Known Forumite
You don't have to buy from shops in town, but it helps encourage businesses but you should always appreciate the things a home town or your residence does well, otherwise why live there :britain:

Im sorry but that has got to be the quote of the year! Im sure with an attitude like that, you will encourage outsiders to come and set up businesses or reside here. Come to Stafford, if you dont agree with us, go elsewhere.........nice!
Oh and thats a union jack uk flag not a stafford knot ;)
 

Gareth

Well-Known Forumite
Not at all Miss Red, I am all for views but their has to be balance to discussion and I am not one of these that defends this and that and has rose tinted glasses on, I don't even live in Stafford but I did make a bee line for a project here because of what Stafford has to offer and its upcoming future. But you have had alot of negativity about the town and seem to take every opportunity to take a swipe and play down other peoples opinions if they haven't been in agreement.

And you are right, people views may change from where they come from, at a recent stag do (well December) a night out in Birmingham was so poor and quiet we were back at the hotel by 11.30. I've had better nights out in Newport, Stoke, Wolverhampton and many in Stafford, maybe it was due to expections I am not sure but I wouldn't go back again. An odd segway I know and P.S. it wasn't supposed to be a Staffs Knot although if I'd seen it I would have added it ;) :stafford:
 

United57

Well-Known Forumite
"Jonathan Andrew, president of the Stafford Chamber of Commerce, said he believed the issue of empty units in areas like Princes Street was down to the size of them.
“I do think Stafford is doing quite well compared to empty shops nationally,” he said.
“The difficulty we have is there are the wrong kind of retail units available for rent.
“A number of retailers want to move to Stafford but they are being held back as the units are too small.”

The last thing we want are more larger shops, we need independent smaller shops and a thriving market. We need a council and chamber of commerce to live in the real world. Towns that are doing well attract visitors because they have something unique, independent shops and cheap parking.

To add more larger shops means

Stafford Council do something radical lets have free parking?
 

Dabbler

Well-Known Forumite
The last thing we want are more larger shops, we need independent smaller shops and a thriving market. We need a council and chamber of commerce to live in the real world. Towns that are doing well attract visitors because they have something unique, independent shops and cheap parking.
I think you are right, we do need independent smaller shops, and we do need a market that can thrive. For independent smaller shops, we need retail units that are the right size and price that they are affordable - high overhead costs will deter lots of smaller businesses from taking on prime location retail premises.




Admin Edit: Quote tags added.
 

Miss Red

Well-Known Forumite
I agree I posted somewhere that stafford seems to have a lack of shops - not compared to bham city centers big stores- but sutton or surrounding (which are also towns) who have a lot of independant stores and thrieving markets - there is no choice here! unless you come from a one shop town lol
 

tek-monkey

wanna see my snake?
When I lived in Southampton (about 12 years ago) the city centre itself was crap, nothing but chain shops selling clothes. It was all the smaller original town centres from before they merged that had the good shops. In fact, as far as I remember there were no supermarkets whatsoever near the town centre. They were all consigned to the outer fringes, giving the other shops a fighting chance.
 

Gramaisc

Forum O. G.
Shops also need a reasonable supply of buying customers. I doubt that many businesses have left the town until they've ceased to have sufficient income, making it pointless to continue. I suspect that you need to have quite a considerable amount coming in regularly to cover rent, rates and other necessary outgoings - then you might have some left for staffing, advanced payments for stock, fittings, etc..

I remember a French town planner saying that their policy of having large, out-of-town hypermarkets was actually intended to help the remaining town centre businesses by separating competition, and it seems to have worked to a good extent there, for some reason.
 

Gareth

Well-Known Forumite
Even when you look at areas like Sutton Coldfield where independent trading is quite good, but even then the town itself has a vacancy rate of around 20% when I visited the council for a week in December 2011, although the council has good plans afoot to sort this out and they have made an application for this Government/ Portas to support ailing towns (although 100k won't get far). Sutton got to such as state the council fired the town centre manager last year in an area that for the most part is quite well off. Part of the issue is Birmingham to contend with there.
 

Gramaisc

Forum O. G.
Even when you look at areas like Sutton Coldfield where independent trading is quite good, but even then the town itself has a vacancy rate of around 20% when I visited the council for a week in December 2011, although the council has good plans afoot to sort this out and they have made an application for this Government/ Portas to support ailing towns (although 100k won't get far). Sutton got to such as state the council fired the town centre manager last year in an area that for the most part is quite well off. Part of the issue is Birmingham to contend with there.
The 'Portas Fund' seems to be largely unspent - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-21775773 .
 

Thumper

Newbie
Ghost Town might be a little hysterical, yes there have been places closing recently which is to be regretted but Stafford is really no different to most similarly sized towns in the UK, and if you compare shop vacancy rates in Stafford with nearby towns then we are fairing somewhat better – have you visited Dudley recently?

Perhaps some of the shops closing should be grasped as an opportunity. We all know that more people are shopping on the internet, shopping out of town or just not shopping at all –we now have too many shops. This is being made worse by the likes of the County Council building more units as part of their new offices (which of course as predicted lie empty)
The town needs to reflect reality if it is to survive and prosper. Rents are astronomic and it is quite clear that we will be stuck with vacant units ad infinitum unless action is taken. Start by relocating businesses (the very few that are actually left) from the Princess Row area and demolish from Cash Converters right along to the old Walmsley Furniture shop. This area could be better used as open space or as town centre accommodation – it has been shown for example in the pleasant looking development alongside “The Yard” that if is done sensitively town centre accommodation can work. It also brings more people right into the heart of town.

Stafford like everywhere else has to adapt or die. This impasse where we have empty units and huge shop rents that leads to more empty units and more degradation is a self fulfilling prophecy. Town Centres in 2012 have to offer something different and that includes a mix of High Street Chains, local shops, green space, and accommodation – i.e. they have to be places where people actually want to visit, work and do business.


There are plenty of customers in Stafford -- enough to support a thriving and diverse town centre -- but they're all down at Asda, Tescos and Sainsbury.

Any fool could predict what the effect would be of introducing these retails giants into the middle of town; greater pressure on local businesses and a reduction of the retail mix to the extent that shoppers now have little option but to head to one of the chains. And I hear there are more coming, too.

But the present situation isn't an act of God or the natural order of things -- it's the result of conscious planning decisions by the local council.

They could have decided to protect independent local businesses and cultivate a diverse town centre. They could have decided to brand Stafford as a unique destination -- not a facsimile of every other small town in the region. There are a thousand things that could have been done and plenty of examples to follow. But that would have taken imagination and vision when it's far easier to bend over for a few big clients and call it "job creation" and "the market", when of course it's nothing of the sort. Death by slow strangulation, more like.

See this report by the Pratt Institute:
http://prattcenter.net/sites/default/files/publications/PrattCenter_SavingIndependentRetail.pdf
 

tek-monkey

wanna see my snake?
I'm sure I remember uproar about out of town developments, over fears they would draw customers away from the town centres. Not sure they can win, but putting an extra supermarket onto what is effectively the stafford town ringroad doesn't seem like the best plan.
 

Gramaisc

Forum O. G.
I'm sure I remember uproar about out of town developments, over fears they would draw customers away from the town centres. Not sure they can win, but putting an extra supermarket onto what is effectively the stafford town ringroad doesn't seem like the best plan.
If they do have a plan, then it's a very cunning one...
 

70-plus

Well-Known Forumite
If they do have a plan, then it's a very cunning one...
Supermarkets sell everything and therefore people buy from them and if they don't have what they want they go on line. It's only specialist shops that people want like the electrician in town who can sell anything at a good price. I asked about the Coop - so far there is no-one coming into the Co-op. that's going to make the high street really desolate.
 

Gareth

Well-Known Forumite
Not sure some know what they are talking about or just make stuff up. First off the co-op could have potentially 2 high street names sharing, nothing is done and dusted but to say no interest is way off base.
Second, the likes of Asda ,sainsburys are not responsible for high street decline at all. These businesses have been around for years and profit margins on anything but food for tesco and sainburys almost make it pointless. Some are forgetting the high was at a boom 7 years ago across the country, town centres are hindered by rates, retail parks, people's attitude to shopping and the advance on online shopping. Food industry supermarkets have been part of our make up since the 70s, they went hand in hand in the high street.
But people of Stafford should not worry, towns like Stafford have smaller populas and less choice but still have vacancy rates less than brum, stoke, wolves etc.
Stafford is currently in a unique position and although the country is struggling Stafford's town centre will be ahead of most in 2 to 3 years so long as SBC do not screw up. Until Stafford will suffer like every town and city and this is going to get worse I can assure you.
 
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