Stafford knot

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markmh

Well-Known Forumite
Hi all

Was just wondering who owns the image/copy rights to the Staffordshire knot? Would it be the county council?

Mark
 
Gramaisc

Gramaisc

Forum O. G.
I would presume that the basic design is old enough to be in the public domain, as long as you don't copy a particular version of it..
 
T

tekkers

Well-Known Forumite
You have to pay a donation to someone to use it I think, for some reason I remember someone saying it was a Lord, correct me though ha ha.
 
United57

United57

Well-Known Forumite
tekkers said:
You have to pay a donation to someone to use it I think, for some reason I remember someone saying it was a Lord, correct me though ha ha.
Click to expand...
Lord Stafford ?
 
Ecker

Ecker

Well-Known Forumite
If you are going to do any searches on the knot, you might want to try "Stafford Knot" as well as "Staffordshire Knot". Apparently it was originally known as "Stafford Knot".

Just wondering that since there is confusion about its name, may there also be confusion about copyright (if copyright exists on it of course).
 
Withnail

Withnail

Well-Known Forumite
The Stafford Knot is the heraldic badge of the Stafford family - i doubt Lord Stafford actually has any rights over its use though.

And it is very much Stafford Knot not Staffordshire, though many people call it that in error.
 
G

gilesjuk

Well-Known Forumite
If you draw it yourself without looking at a particular rendition of it then I'm sure you're okay. You can't really place restrictions on drawing of a bit of rope.

I'm amazed it's such a popular icon given its grizzly purpose (hanging three people with one noose).
 
M

markmh

Well-Known Forumite
so the consensus seems to be its likely to be a publicly owned image but its worth checking with the council. i was going to use it as part of a brand and didnt want to end up being sued or anything.
 
riverwayevents

riverwayevents

Riverway Events
In the mid-ninetys, Stafford CC played a midweek fixture against Swynnerton CC. It was the first game where we had worn a batch of caps we'd ordered c/w with the Stafford knot on the front. When we started dishing out the caps before the game, Lord Stafford and his brother who had links/played fro Swynnerton came up and questioned our "right" to use the knot!! They were only teasing but went onto say that there is no such thing as the "Staffordshire" knot only the "Stafford" knot. It did indeed belong to their family (if belong was the right word) and only two organisations had ever been given permission to use the knot on any clothing/uniform etc and that was the Staffordshire Regiment and one other lot , the name of who escapes me unfortunately. They also said that the "knot" originated when "Herawood the Wake" who split "the knot" ....once upon a time for some reason that also escapes me.
As it happens the game got tagged with the Curse of the Knot because Swynnerton bowled us out for a paltry 29.
 
Gramaisc

Gramaisc

Forum O. G.
riverwayevents said:
In the mid-ninetys, Stafford CC played a midweek fixture against Swynnerton CC. It was the first game where we had worn a batch of caps we'd ordered c/w with the Stafford knot on the front. When we started dishing out the caps before the game, Lord Stafford and his brother who had links/played fro Swynnerton came up and questioned our "right" to use the knot!! They were only teasing but went onto say that there is no such thing as the "Staffordshire" knot only the "Stafford" knot. It did indeed belong to their family (if belong was the right word) and only two organisations had ever been given permission to use the knot on any clothing/uniform etc and that was the Staffordshire Regiment and one other lot , the name of who escapes me unfortunately. They also said that the "knot" originated when "Herawood the Wake" who split "the knot" ....once upon a time for some reason that also escapes me.
As it happens the game got tagged with the Curse of the Knot because Swynnerton bowled us out for a paltry 29.
Click to expand...
An example of a 'Wake Knot' -

8139E58A_F165_33DE_1F726B784C6109B3.jpg


originating from the legend of Hereward the Wake.
 
Withnail

Withnail

Well-Known Forumite
Hereward was known as 'The Exile' in his lifetime - the Wake family (Lincolnshire way?) claimed to descend from him, which they didn't, at the time that the upper clarses were trying to be more English. Around the same time the Stafford Knot first appears as it happens, the de Staffords probably doing the same thing and creating a Celtic ancestry for themselves. I believe, but may be wrong, that there was a Stafford Knot of Saxon origin on a tomb or somesuch in Castle Church.

The other organisation that used the Knot was a Staffordhire railway company i think.
 
fatfrog

fatfrog

Well-Known Forumite
I have used the Stafford knot several times in different projects and there has never been a problem although I have drawn it up my self each time for clients, unless they have had their own version
 
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