Yet another reason to work hard and try to do well for yourself...

[shoes]

... house worth over £1 million. Well you're bad, very very bad! All that money you have circulated in the economy is not welcome and as such we're going to take it off you.

Thank god no one takes them seriously.

 

[Alan B'Stard]

Have you considered moving to a low tax country?

http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=107188

 

[shoes]

Indeed, I am working my way up to being able to earn enough money to move. Don't think a little bit of hard work for a much happier future will hurt me so I'm going for it. One of the positives from this country's severe lack of education and aspiration withing my generation is it's making it a lot easier to progress quickly so it's not all doom and gloom eh?

 

[tek-monkey]

TBH, I'm not sure I really mind this one. If the money is to help remove income tax for low earners, not going to scroungers, I don't see it as that bad. It is VERY hard to live on minimum wage, this would help them a lot by adding approx £1500 to their take home wage. Everyone has to start somewhere, this helps them. It may also make working more attractive than dossing.

I'm not sure this is the way to do it, but simple maths shows the money needs to come from somewhere. Labour have fooked up any chances of not upping taxes, and taxing those on lower incomes more will make being on benefits more attractive. Therefore we have to tax those richer, although just closing tax loopholes would sort out most of it. If the money is made in this country it should be taxed in this country.

 

[shoes]

Yes but as I keep explaining if you pay a proportion of your income then the more you earn the more you will pay. Mathematically its sound, but because you have say had an idea and turned it into a great business (which is NOT easy) the government take 40% from you instead of the basic 20%. And now even after the government have stolen twice as much proportionally, probably 10 times as much in real money from you, you manage to buy property like this to secure your retirement and live the happy life you deserve the government take even more off of you. For what? To make life easier for someone who has a low paid job? Bollocks.

Stop taxing the affluent working man an FORCE companies to pay higher wages, particularly those who claim 3 billion profits year on year and continue to pay their staff NMW.... supermarkets are a classic example of this. Make low paid jobs higher paid, and stop abusing those who have fought hard to get to where they are.

As much as I dislike the man I'm going to stick up for my father here because the 45 years he has slogged his bollocks off both working full time as a highly skilled airline pilot and also procuring and successfully managing several business interests, creating jobs, cashflow and paying tax on the lot. He now has a house worth circa £2m which means he's now liable (bearing in mind he's a retired man now in his 60's) for an horrendous tax levvy if the liberals get their way.

Sorry mate if it means screwing over those who actually manage to do well for themselves then I'm all for saying f**k the poor. If someone with half a brain wants to get involved and raise NMW and actually force these massive companies to stop making so much profit which is essentially useless when everyone has been paid then things would be better.

 

[Monquey]

I'd hate to have to live in your simplistic, hate-fuelled world shoes. You genuinely seem to believe that affluence is the best, and only measure of success in this world, and that if you work hard you will be paid well. ONLY in the finance sector is this the case, and are they REALLY working hard and benefitting society more than low-paid hard working ordinary people who you clearly despise so much.

One of the major things wrong with this country is your utterly contemptible 'feck the poor, because I'm alright' attitude, echoed by so many.I genuinely hope you DO get together a lot of money if it means you'll feck off to another country as soon as possible and take your sour blinkered views with you. Where, exactly would you move to, what fabled land peopled only by right wing mail reading asshats who pay no tax, and presumably have their bins emptied, their houses built, their children schooled and their wounds tended by robots or something?

Edit: I'm beginning to think you're actually just a really elaborate troll.

 

[shoes]

LOL!!!!

I'm not hate filled, I'm actually very happy, although I know I will be happier once I've fulfilled my ambitions. As for hard work = good pay only in the finance sector is a comple load of bollocks.

As for tax I am under no illusion that no one should pay tax, I realise how necessary it is for society. What irritates me though is the level at which we're taxed and even worse how this tax money is then haemorrhaged by the incompetant 'leaders' before the next wave of begging letters and mandatory tax rises. For what? To support the ever increasing population of council estate mothers with their three different fathered children of which none of the fathers are present because they too came from the same background and are now in prison? At a cost to the tax payer? Its unbelieveably frustrating that no matter how much money is thrown at the NHS, schooling, transport we just cannot seem to get it right and in response all we do is take the minority who have been able to make their way up the ladder int his world and tax the living daylights out of them.

There is so much wrong with how this country is run and it is so unfair to anyone who manages to drag themselves above the frankly insulting minimum wage.

The fact that we are at a stage now where we PAY CRIMINALS not to commit crime and have some pansy arsed spinless approach to justice is appauling in this country, that we encourage people NOT to work by offering them welfare packages which are BETTER than working and then wondering why we have council estates with crime rates spiraling out of control and with populations exponentially expanding AT MORE COST TO THE TAX PAYER!?!?

You may think I'm an elaborate troll, I think you're a blind goon.

Sorry if I seem selfish but i don't work 70 hours a week in a very high stress position to pay for the existence of the likes of Lunar Scorpian et all.

 

[My Name is URL]

How on gods earth did you get:

'feck the poor, because I'm alright' attitude, echoed by so many.

from a post that contains:

Make low paid jobs higher paid, and stop abusing those who have fought hard to get to where they are.

You either didn't read what Shoes was writing properly, or you just read a bit and jumped to your own conclusions......

The only people I have ever known shoes slate is lazy arsed twunts that sit around on their arses never working, popping our sproggs and expecting the state to keep them.... and on that one, i'm with him.

 

[shoes]

Cheers GK, nice to know I'm not completely alone in my bubble of common sense

 

[db]

shoes, seriously, you wouldn't think the world is such a bad place if you'd just stop reading the daily mail! lol.. i'm not even joking, this isn't a "hurrr daily fail " post, i honestly think if you stopped reading it you might lighten up a bit..

i used to hold a lot of strong, blinkered views on life (and the UK in particular), but since i realised how sensationalised the media is it's bothered me less and less.. the reason all these ridiculous stories are "news" in the first place is because they stick out from the meandering, functioning processes that are in place.. they are not the norm.. this particular news story is a poor example, because many unselfish people may agree with it in principle.. i'm more referring to all the "benefits scrounger" posts that you love to post and that really get a bee in your bonnet..

the problem with going off on one like this is that it totally undermines any valid points you may have, as people will just start to see you as a right-wing loon who no-one in their right mind would listen to! i agree strongly with some of the things you post on here, but i have found recently that i just cringe at a lot of your outbursts and i would feel embarrassed to publicly align myself with you.. please understand that i'm not saying this to have a pop at you - i'm just wondering if perhaps you don't realise this, and so hoping it gives you a chance to step back and have a breather! lol..

i remember us having a very similar conversation when you first joined the forum, and jumped right in with both feet extolling the virtues of eugenics, public lynchings, etc. lol..

 

[shoes]

Oh FFS whats the point?!

If you're all happy to be taken for a ride then fine, but I'm not and I work hard for what I have (not saying that you lot don't) and I'm proud of it. I'm proud that I have ambition, drive and motivation to want to do well and it pains me to see my hard work being whipped away from me to give to the absolute scum of the earth, both here and the EU parasites, and yet seeing those who truly need it being cast aside by society. It actually makes me angry that 99% of charaties get sod all from our tax kitty and yet Lunar Scorpian is fed, watered, housed and given pocket money. Surely that must bug you? Then again, and I mean this with all due respect, i doubt you work even close to anywhere near how hard I do.

 

[Furbal]

I agree with tek on the definite advantages to this and am all for removing tax for the very low paid, but don't think this is the way to raise the required funds. Currently council tax is based on valuations made in 1991 by the Tory government who did a rushed, half-assed attempt at valuing properties and this needs addressing before any more taxes are introduced.

Currently the highest band, H, is for properties worth £320k (in 1991), so even if house prices have more than doubled since then, a £800k house now pays the same as multi-million pound mansions. It seems more than fair that new banding is introduced so that everyone pays tax at a rate that is proportional to the value of their property. Someone with a 2 million pound house should pay more than the current highest band, but an extra £5000 is more than excessive in my book.

 

[tek-monkey]

Why can't we scrap all taxation other than when spending money? Forget income tax, just have extortionate VAT. It would close an awful lot of ways out of taxation, make money earnt = money gained and be a completely fair tax to all. Assume currency conversions are a form of spending, so removing the money from the UK also effectively pays tax.

Simples!

 

[shoes]

Why can't we scrap all taxation other than when spending money? Forget income tax, just have extortionate VAT. It would close an awful lot of ways out of taxation, make money earnt = money gained and be a completely fair tax to all. Assume currency conversions are a form of spending, so removing the money from the UK also effectively pays tax.

Simples!

What a bloody good idea!

 

[My Name is URL]

but since i realised how sensationalised the media is it's bothered me less and less.. the reason all these ridiculous stories are "news" in the first place is because they stick out from the meandering, functioning processes that are in place.. they are not the norm..

When you say sensationalised, do you mean that the stories are exadgerated i.e. "illegal immigrant mother of 10 kids gets £1m a year benefits" or do you mean that the "illegal immigrant mother of 10 kids" may actually get £200,000 a year in benefits but its just 0.5% of the population like her off so it doesn't matter?

I guess you mean the second?

Does the fact that they are not the norm make it ok though? I wouldn't have thought that was what you were saying but now i'm not so sure.

Didn't newspapers uncover the MP's expenses scandal.... it could have been a sensationalist story as well if it hadn't uncovered the fact that hundreds more of the parasites were all milking the system....

I'm not sure where i'm going with this..... I guess I understand some bits of your post but don't understand lots of other bits...

 

[tek-monkey]

What a bloody good idea!

There's a bloody big hole in it somewhere, I just can't work out where at the moment!

 

[shoes]

Yes, it's far too simple and sensible for our government to even consider it. Why have that when you can have a horrendously complicated and unfair tax system that isn't truly understood by anyone, even those who created it?

 

[Sofa]

Shoes, perhaps if you worked a little less you would have more time to enjoy yourself, be less stressed and find the chance to re-assess what is really important in life. If you did, you just may find that the things like friends and community, which are hugely important factors in a healthy and happy life, don't cost a penny.

Perhaps it would be good at this point in the thread to point out the main differences in how people on the left think from those on the right. I read a study about this not so long ago, (can't find it now, of course) and I expect we can all agree with the concept. People who grow up with fear as their overriding emotion, who are, shall we say, more sensitive and likely to experience fear, tend to be right-wing thinkers. Others, who, for whatever reason, could be nature, could be nurture, grow up feeling confident and are not so likely to perceive situations as "fearful" tend to be left-wing thinkers.

It stands to reason. The right tends to talk about 'keeping them out', 'stop them taking from you', 'defend what is yours'. The left tends to be the other way and is so relaxed it even comes up with ideas like "from those who have to those who need".

Don't believe me? Have a look at this recent study and make your own mind up.

Shoes, it seems to me that you fit the classic right-wing fear-driven mold. And, you see, that's ok. Because, coming from the opposite end of the spectrum, I have not only an understanding that people can think differently to me, but even sympathy for your plight. That surely sounds very condescending and inflammatory, but it is not meant to be, it is just my opinion.

What you are saying makes it sound like you cannot tolerate others who are less fortunate than you, yet you must surely understand that there will always be people from all walks and of every imaginable nature and character on this planet. People who can't or won't accept reality end up believing all sorts of extreme nonsense and sometimes acting on those sick beliefs.

What Vince Cable proposed is an annual 0.5% tax on property above £1m. Now, I am not an economics expert, but if you can find me someone owns a £2m property who could not easily afford that extra £5,000 tax per year, I will eat my own hat. Shoes, do you really find the idea of freeing the 4m lowest-earning workers from tax so bad? Poverty costs this country billions every year and there can be no defense for such a developed nation as ours to have around 3m children living below the poverty line.

But, Shoes, perhaps, you are alright, Jack.

 

[db]

what the hell is the world coming to when i agree with sofa over shoes?? lol..

interesting post, sofa.. i was initially poised to hit the "reply" button and pour scorn on the "fear" theory, but if i'm honest i would probably have to say i agree with some of it..

although, it has to be said:

Shoes, it seems to me that you fit the classic right-wing fear-driven mold. And, you see, that's ok. Because, coming from the opposite end of the spectrum, I have not only an understanding that people can think differently to me, but even sympathy for your plight.

 

[db]

but since i realised how sensationalised the media is it's bothered me less and less.. the reason all these ridiculous stories are "news" in the first place is because they stick out from the meandering, functioning processes that are in place.. they are not the norm..

When you say sensationalised, do you mean that the stories are exadgerated i.e. "illegal immigrant mother of 10 kids gets £1m a year benefits" or do you mean that the "illegal immigrant mother of 10 kids" may actually get £200,000 a year in benefits but its just 0.5% of the population like her off so it doesn't matter?

i mean that these cases you read about occasionally are exceptions, the media ignore the millions of others who get the correct amount of benefits and for whom the system works correctly.. do i agree with some fat mess getting to live in a mansion for free with all her bills paid and a fat salary in the form of government handouts? of course not, but they are unfortunate exceptional cases arising from an imperfect system..

i'm not saying that everything is fine in this country - nothing could be further from the truth, alas - but i'm just saying that i don't think it's as bad as some seem to think it is, and believing every little story in the daily mail and assuming it is indicative of everyday life in britain is foolish, imo..