Dossers

[MyCult]

scuttles away into a dark corner to think about what he's done...

 

[shoes]

well, tbh i agree with some of the fundamental changes you allude to, i just think you're taking the solution to extremes.. i don't think the death penalty is the answer, and certainly not for crimes like theft.. people who commit crime think they aren't going to get caught, so it doesn't matter what the penalty is it will never deter them.. once they have spent some time inside, however, and the cold reality of the consequences of their actions sets in, they might reconsider in future.. this relies, of course, on wookie's suggestion of prison reform..

Ok yes, this makes perfect sense. We should perhaps take a look at Thai prisons. That would do the trick. Publicise it too - lots.

i think your national service suggestion is a good one, but only when all other avenues have been exhausted..

Yes, I agree, I listed a few avenues, couldn't think of them all off hand but if we put it down to council busy bodies to decide then we will inevitably end up with costly BS avenues which eventually lead to nothing except another hole in my wallet.

your ideas on licensing children are ridiculous.. i agree that "baby factories" need to be stopped, but simply making abortion "as easy as gettin a tumour removed" won't help a bit.. you realise that many people oppose abortion on moral grounds? not me, incidentally - i think it's ridiculous that anyone would have a child when they don't feel ready rather than just getting a pill from the clinic - but a huge amount of people are disgusted by this notion.. i can't believe you'd be so narrow minded as to think that the only reason people follow through with pregnancies is because abortion is "difficult"! and there is absolutely no way you could legislate forced abortions.. the way things are at the moment, you can't even force people to do their jobs if it offends their religious/moral sensibilities - how on earth do you think you could force medical procedures on people??

Making abortion easy would at least have some impact, as its horrendously difficult to get one. As for moral and religious views, how moral is it for a 17 year old to have a child? I am 22 and well educated and I do not consider myself experienced enough in life to raise a child. Let alone these baby factories who have only learnt to spell their own name because they have filled in so many benefit forms! If not licencing then we need to do something to stop people who are unable to support a child (without the help of the state) and those who will clearly be crap parents from producing children.

Ok so you can say punishments for this that and the other but enforcing this one is pointless once a baby has been conceived unless you get rid of it.

Whilst I agree prevention is the best cure, nothing has been successful thus far.

Re: people's religious views it think its obsurd that you have to make allowances in the workplace. I'm sure every employer in the world will tell their employee to keep personal and work lives apart and as far as I'm concerned religion is a life choice and is personal to you. I am not against religion nor those who practice it, but as with everything there is a time and a place. And if your job opposes your moral standing point then you're an idiot for applying for the job in the first place. Off to Chav Royale for you!

I am a very conservative person because I hate working and seeing my hard earned money wasted on crap and people who don't deserve it. By the same token it pisses me off that those who really need and deserve the help have to wait months for a service which ends up being inadaquate.

your token based benefits system is interesting, though..

Yup I thought so, would require some serious debate one what denotes a luxury and what is a necessity. No douby the politically correct looney brigate will denote that registered alcoholics should be allowed to buy alcohol and there is a pocket money allowance

 

[shoes]

Here's one for you, breed out the poor. /retires to a safe distance

ok, now i realise i've just been well and truly trolled

dammit, i thought we were getting some serious and interesting debate for once! i blame you, mycult, for introducing trolling to this forum! lol

No the rest of the debate is serious, that was just there for my own amusement more than anything. Believe me, I DO NOT feel that way!

I'd be more than happy to continue with the serious debate though.

 

[tek-monkey]

Bloody hell, mushroomed indeed! I do have a few views on unemployment benefits, possibly voiced them on this forum before? Anyway, main bullet points:

1) Sliding scale, contributions based benefits. You get good money for a few weeks, slowly dropping away til you hit six months or so. Then you go on a token based system for 80% of your benefits, paid for with a credit card style thing. After 9 months, restrict what this can be spent on (no fags or booze), also forced labour one day a week to better the society you live in (sorting recycling, cleaning waterways etc.). Make working a better alternative than freeloading, possibly reduce bogus claims while your at it as the tokens will be worth less than real cash to the crims.

2) Benefits paid for kids had while working, all benefits for kids conceived whilst on benefits are half those of kids whilst working. All child benefits to be put on said card, school meals provided to ensure kids are fed. Contraception is free, use it when its needed. If against your religion, stop shagging all the time. Its no excuse, if religion made you have kids every married catholic would have 20 kids by the time they hit 40.

3) Prisons should suck, big time. Use army style tactics, forced excercise, made to work doing horrible jobs nobody else will. Send recycling here too. No entertainment other than books, definately no games consoles or TVs regardless of reasons.

Am sure there's more, but its been a long day at work and I need to eat.

 

[Wookie]

GAH!!! I've spent nearly an hour trying to get the attributions right, and I'm bloody giving up now. Has anyone got a good BBCode debugger? Keeps complaining about missing quote tags, BUT DOESN'T SEEM ABLE TO TELL ME WHERE THEY ARE!!!!!
Without attribution. Fix it as you read...
(Someone tell me what the hell was wrong with using >s? )

Birmingham Six? Guildford Four? Bridgwater HoweverManyThereWere? On the day we execute a provably innocent person, I expect you to jump off a cliff. Without the benefit of a parachute, either.
Seriously, dude, in a justice system designed and run by fallible humans who are more concerned with winning than truth, the death penalty's bushlit.
How many people are currently in prison that would be executed If You Ran The World, shoes?

Loads, whats the difference between condeming an innocent person to death and to prison, either way their life is pretty much over. Especially with the 'top three' which get life?

The difference is, if we can demonstrate their innocence later (which in some cases, not least the above named three, we could) WE CAN FREE THEM.
Sure, there'd be a lot of grovelling and apologising going on afterwards, but still...

Is this the list of people you'd execute?

Amongst others, yes.

The others being...?

I agree, let's make the prisons a horrible place that people will do almost anything to stay out of.

I think the fear of death by hanging would be even more of a deterrant.

The death penalty doesn't deter.
Consider: crimes are committed for profit, for passion or for compulsion.
If profit, the criminal has weighed up the odds and convinced themselves they can cover up the evidence enough to escape conviction.
If passion, the criminal loses sight of the consequences in a heat-of-the-moment... well... passion.
If compulsion, the criminal can't help it.

Ah, so individual reform is possible?

Of course it is! However I think that some actions are unforgivable.

Such as...?

You don't by any chance drive a Hackney, do you? :p

No, I have a propper job and have to pay in excess of £350 - £400 a month in tax and NI depending on how much OT I do. This is why I'm so pissed off. My parents pay in excess of £40,000 in tax a year and they are not wealthy (although they would with another £40k a year!!). You don't sell Vauxall parts, do you? :p

I'll do anything that pays a wage, from flogging car accessories to keeping educational institutional computer systems running. :p

Take a harsh view on crime, introduce national service and make people have to apply for a licence to have children.

Agreed, define your terms and what happens to children born to unlicensed parents?

If you leave school at 16 and you are not going into further education (i.e. 6th form, college, appretichip, on the job training, armed forces, being a full time carer for a relative or whatever.... etc.) or you are not going directly into work, i.e. you will be a drain on society and not learning anything in the meantime to make youself more useful to society in the future then you should have to do national service. Part of the deal will be you have to undertake a form of education (of your choice I am not suggesting we force people to study something they don't want to) and pass the qualification in order to be excused from national service. Children born to unlicenced parents won't happen, abortion is taken far too seriously and as such I will make it as easy as gettin a tumour removed. Mandatory abortion for unlicenced parents. Accidents to happen, but lets be honest, its usually those chav scum assholes who 'have accidents' and are not fit to be parents anyway. I know this is not the case for everyone, it would be ludicrious to suggest so, but it's a general observation.

Depends how you define "National Service". If you mean "Be of service to the nation", I couldn't agree more. If you mean "Right, you 'orrible lot! This is a gun, this is a trigger, get on this plane to this warzone, point the gun at people a different colour from you and pull the trigger!", we're going to have another philosophical banging of heads.
I have no practical experience of abortion - wrong sex and all that - but my understanding is that it is not to be taken lightly. Certainly not as lightly as you seem to take it.

Agreed. If you had a system whereby the DWP found you two jobs and if you didn't accept them your benefit was stopped, you'd only have to offer some people a dishwashing job and a streetcleaning job and they'd be off the benefit before you could say 'parasite'. (Good old Sir Humphrey...)

As much as I would love to agree with this, and its an idea i would love to implement it would just lead to a massive increase in crime. Then again if we had harsher punishments maybe the idea of a job would be more attractive.

The benefits system needs overhauling. How about a token system, instead of having £44 or whatever you get the same in tokens which can only be spent on food, electric etc. not luxuries, cigarettes, drugs, alcohol etc. Again, would make working that much more attractive.

Wouldn't such a token system lead to increased crime as people try to steal the money that honest, straight-up working people like you and I earn? At least now the risk is spread by knowing there's at least a chance they're breaking into *each other's* houses and running off with *each other's* property... but if all they have is food and electricity, who's going to break in and nick that, eh? No, they'll be round mine, smashing windows and carting off that 52" plasma screen I saved for two years to buy*.


*Not really. But I think it illustrates the point I'm making.




Admin edit: added quote tags, which really wasn't difficult and you should be ashamed of yourself, Wookie!

 

[shoes]

All sounds pretty sensible, especially using prisoners to sort recycling etc. I disagree that kids should be penalised due to their parents poor choices but using the creditcard system, allowing the same benefits for the child, which can only be used for specific purchases.

 

[shoes]

Is this the list of people you'd execute?
Amongst others, yes.
The others being...?

Well, anyone of no worth to society providing they are of able body and mind.

Such as...?

Rape, murder, fiddling with children or having anything at all to do with it, yobs who will tackle an 80 year old lady to the ground and break her hip just for her handbag.

I'll do anything that pays a wage, from flogging car accessories to keeping educational institutional computer systems running. :p

Fair play to you, I wasn't attacking your line of work, I assume you know who I am and I was referring to another thread (see driving instructors). If you don't know who I am, I'm the bloke who used to work with you on the IT systems for an educational institution.

Wouldn't such a token system lead to increased crime as people try to steal the money that honest, straight-up working people like you and I earn? At least now the risk is spread by knowing there's at least a chance they're breaking into *each other's* houses and running off with *each other's* property... but if all they have is food and electricity, who's going to break in and nick that, eh? No, they'll be round mine, smashing windows and carting off that 52" plasma screen I saved for two years to buy*.

Believe me if I was a law maker, ANYONE who broke into my house would need serious surgery go get righted again once my Manfrotto and I had finished with them, I would have not broken a law and the dickhead who broke into my house would be refused any treatment on the NHS.

The way labour runs this country I can't even hit someone who breaks into my house unless I can prove they physically threatened me. Obsurd.

I think humiliation is a good idea too... have them bound in town square with a sign "I break into people's houses because I'm scum" with a selection of rotten fruit by the side. Make it the only zone where urinating in public is acceptable too. Chavs would love it cos they could spit to their heart's content.

 

[tek-monkey]

As I said earlier though, we may be too late. With all the immigration we've seen recently, I'm not sure there are enough jobs to go round any more. I don't blame the immigrants for this, far from it, they have shown the enterprising spirit our own society is sorely lacking. If there really is no job to go to though, what then? Is it really fair to penalise someone because there is no job for them to do?

We are of course talking jobs = 0, not jobs you'd like.

 

[shoes]

As I said earlier though, we may be too late. With all the immigration we've seen recently, I'm not sure there are enough jobs to go round any more. I don't blame the immigrants for this, far from it, they have shown the enterprising spirit our own society is sorely lacking. If there really is no job to go to though, what then? Is it really fair to penalise someone because there is no job for them to do?

We are of course talking jobs = 0, not jobs you'd like.

We're a long way from jobs = 0. I have another solution... list everyone who is on jobseekers in chronological order. Each time an immigrant comes in and gets a job, we send the person who claims they cant get a job for the longest period to the country where the now working immigrant originated. The jobs available would be snapped up by the JSA crew in no time!

 

[Andreas Rex]

Hey shoes! Long time no see...and welcome to the forum!

obsurd

I am 22 and well educated

ABSURD



...P.S....loving this thread. I know I don't often voice my political/religious opinions on here...it's usually a review of the latest available, but whether or not shoes is putting up his own viewpoint or that of many others to get reaction; this thread is ace!

 

[shoes]

Well spotted... damn you! What you been doing with yourself fella? Aside from fence sitting

Most of it is my own viewpoint, but it stems from getting so pissed off about working so hard and having so little to show for it while dole dossers spend every waking hour in the pub or popping out children. Smashed up bus shelters and phone boxes, crime on a constant rise, gettin hassled on the streets by groups of youths produced by the afore mentioned dole dossers, people achieving nothing with their life, gettin no gades at school, ending up unable (allegedly) to get a job because their parents have instilled the mentality that the state will provide. This is what pisses me off, even more so that most of these lazy c**ts don't even understand basic economics, taxation and how the rest of us are being screwed.

No man should bring children into the world who is unwilling to persevere to the end in their nature and education - Plato


EDIT: Actually isn't this what the army is for?

 

[Andreas Rex]

I'd be very interested to find out how many of those commenting on this topic will be attending the Councillors' Question Time, as currently being discussed in another thread. As I said a minute ago, I've not commented much on the forum when religion/political debates are concerned, and it's not because I don't have an opinion. Nor is it because I'm worried that I wouldn't be able to substantiate my thoughts/views/beliefs. I enjoy reading other peoples' comments about things which I have an interest in on the forum. I'm also very aware of how important it is to ask/confront your local councillors/MPs about local issues. Are you going/would you go/have you been to these kind of things before? If the answer is no to any of those then surely it's time to start...

edit: I'm not suggesting that the issues raised in this thread can all be solved by the local government; just that there are lots of posts here from people who are so concerned and verbose with their ideals and beliefs that if they don't contribute to the local debate on similar subjects then they should...

 

[Wookie]

Well, anyone of no worth to society providing they are of able body and mind.

Rape, murder, fiddling with children or having anything at all to do with it, yobs who will tackle an 80 year old lady to the ground and break her hip just for her handbag.

I disagree with you strongly on the rape; men get arrested for that because he thinks he was having a one-night stand with some girl he just met who wakes up afterwards and retrospectively changes her mind. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/lawandorder/2983573/Barman-freed-despite-admitting-raping-12-year-old-girl.html is a case in point.
Murder: An honest, hardworking at 3 jobs to put food on the table man walks into his home and finds his wife in bed with another man and - I think you'll agree reasonably - loses his rag. In the heat of the moment he hits her a bit hard and as a result, she dies. Are you really telling me you'd execute him because he lost his temper when he's provoked?

Fiddling with children: Is that an act of evil or an act of compulsion? Anyway, how do you define "children"? Should a 17yo be put to death because he had sex with his 15yo girlfriend? What about a 40yo who has sex with a post-pubescent 14yo? And what is 'fiddling'?
'Having anything at all to do with it'? So you'd dangle the supermarket checkout girl who sold our hypothetical kiddy-fiddler the lubricant and the cucumber, or whatever it is they use? How far down the chain of involvement do you propose to go?

I'll do anything that pays a wage, from flogging car accessories to keeping educational institutional computer systems running. :p

Fair play to you, I wasn't attacking your line of work, I assume you know who I am and I was referring to another thread (see driving instructors). If you don't know who I am, I'm the bloke who used to work with you on the IT systems for an educational institution.

I know who you are, dude; I didn't namecheck that gig because I particularly enjoyed it, y'know.

Believe me if I was a law maker, ANYONE who broke into my house would need serious surgery go get righted again once my Manfrotto and I had finished with them, I would have not broken a law and the dickhead who broke into my house would be refused any treatment on the NHS.

Granted; as far as I'm concerned, if you're in my home, you're playing by my rules. And if you walked in, as far as possible I'm going to make sure you're carried out.

The way labour runs this country I can't even hit someone who breaks into my house unless I can prove they physically threatened me. Obsurd.

What's the standard of proof for that, do you know? Any lawmen on The Forum? (And by 'lawmen', I mean of course 'lawmen' and 'lawpersons'.)

I think humiliation is a good idea too... have them bound in town square with a sign "I break into people's houses because I'm scum" with a selection of rotten fruit by the side. Make it the only zone where urinating in public is acceptable too. Chavs would love it cos they could spit to their heart's content.

A fun day out for all the family, in fact.

 

[shoes]

I disagree with you strongly on the rape; men get arrested for that because he thinks he was having a one-night stand with some girl he just met who wakes up afterwards and retrospectively changes her mind. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/lawandorder/2983573/Barman-freed-despite-admitting-raping-12-year-old-girl.html is a case in point.

Ok agreed, although it goes without saying that convictions would have to be proven beyond all reasonable doubt.

Re the case in questions its completely conveluted although thats what one expects from the Telegraph. He raped a girl who he was having consentual sex with. How is that rape regardless of how old she is. It could be granted that she didn't know the implications of her actions, either way she needs to be educated and stop being such a little slag. Also as a barman who has to deal with people of all ages including dealing with ID issues he should have been more preceptive. Have you EVER seen a 12 year old who you would believe is 19? If so then you need your eyes tested.

Murder: An honest, hardworking at 3 jobs to put food on the table man walks into his home and finds his wife in bed with another man and - I think you'll agree reasonably - loses his rag. In the heat of the moment he hits her a bit hard and as a result, she dies. Are you really telling me you'd execute him because he lost his temper when he's provoked?

Yes. Unacceptable. Sure she's screwed you over, so screw her over back. The fact you even suggest that hitting a woman is acceptable is somewhat worrying. Why wasn't the lazy bint at work anyway?

Fiddling with children: Is that an act of evil or an act of compulsion? Anyway, how do you define "children"? Should a 17yo be put to death because he had sex with his 15yo girlfriend? What about a 40yo who has sex with a post-pubescent 14yo? And what is 'fiddling'?
'Having anything at all to do with it'? So you'd dangle the supermarket checkout girl who sold our hypothetical kiddy-fiddler the lubricant and the cucumber, or whatever it is they use? How far down the chain of involvement do you propose to go?

Whatever it is it is unacceptable. By the same token you could state that I was compelled to rape this attractive woman, or I felt compelled to kill this person who was holding up the queue in the post office. Utterly ridiculous. We should know the difference between right and wrong regardless of whether we 'feel the urge'. Why don't we just pat them on the head and say there there? I bet you'd want to kill the person who touched your kids?

And whilst I agree its increasingly difficult to tell the age of some under 16's but a 17 y/o sleeping with his 15 y/o old girlfriend is still breaking the law. Assuming that as they are in a relationship that he knows her age. Execution may be a little extreme in this case, agreed. As for the 40 y/o having sex with a 14 year old I doubt it was genuinely consentual. Either way thats f*cking wrong.

With regard to having anything to do with it, I shall rephrase... Knowingly having anything to do with it. Having archives of images, video etc., proof you are involved in 'the scene' etc., carrying out various acts. How can you even think about justifying it as anything other than weak minded people born with loved up intentions and are too lame to fight it. Believe me if anyone touched my kids the police wouldn't even know it ever happened. They would still be 'missing' 50 years later. They'd still be alive too, in my basement in agonising pain.

Granted; as far as I'm concerned, if you're in my home, you're playing by my rules. And if you walked in, as far as possible I'm going to make sure you're carried out.

At least we agree on one thing!

What's the standard of proof for that, do you know? Any lawmen on The Forum? (And by 'lawmen', I mean of course 'lawmen' and 'lawpersons'.)

Just done a bit of googling and came accross the home office website. Apparently reasonable force is allowed but punishing the perpetrator is down to the joke of a legal system we have. Personally I'd reccomment keeping a knife which is of completely different brand to any others in your house and keep your prints off it. When said burgular comes into your house plunge one of your regular kitched knives into his heart and plant the anomolous knife in his hands.

A fun day out for all the family, in fact.

Was this not trialed in Ireland recently? Seems like a good idea to me. As a nation we are pretty sheltered from the going-ons inside prison whereas if the results of your ill actions were so easily accessable to the public it would act as a deterrant. Once again, much much cheaper than a stay at HMP 4-star.

 

[db]

the problem is, your views are so extreme that no-one will ever pay you heed.. you might as well ask for a law to be written stating that all households should have a platinum tap which dispenses beer - it's just never going to happen, so what's the point?

basically, you would only be happy in a world where everyone thinks exactly like you.. you have had to backpeddle a number of times when it has been pointed out to you that the world is not black and white! crimes are not absolute; they have to be judged on circumstance and any number of other factors..

 

[shoes]

I agree that crimes are not black and white, but I also feel that as a decent person living my life not causing trouble to others I should be paid the same respect, but this is not the case. A few years ago someone broke into my car and stole my CD player. I have never done that to anyone else. Have you? Have you ever raped anyone? Murdered anyone? Had sex with a child? Got together with a group of mates and attacked a random stranger? Nor me. Is it acceptable? No! The wishy-washy "there is some good in everyone" approach clearly doesnt work. Neither does allowing the scum of the earth of pop out babies to be groomed into yet more scum.

To be honest I hate this country with a passion, I hate the people who rule it (we all know its not the goventment any more but the underclass Vikki Pollards and their common as shit families instead) and are destroying what was once a great nation. I would leave, but thanks to haveing to pay so much tax to these scum assholes I can't afford to. I have applied to move to Canada, and have passed the initial screening. Just need to save up the required amount of capital which despite my modest income seems near as damnit impossible. EVERY house on council estates have a Sky dish on them plugged into a massive TV screen which never gets watched cos they're always at the pub. I can barely afford broadband let alone sky and an alcohol problem.

Maybe I'm missing something here and am bitter because they know something I don't. When it comes to crime I will sort myself out thanks, anyone who is stupid enough to cross me will not be reported to the police, until such time faith in the justice system has been restored.

FFS you can get as much time as a rapist for having a couple of Kilos of cannabis in your posession. And yet there is still, to date, no recorded fatalities. Alcohol is still legal though. God this country is such a f*ckup. Once I have the capital I'm off and you lot can carry on either ignoring the deterioration around your or enjoying it, whatever you choose.

I'd love to hear your solution to the problems. In the meantime if you're going to tear mine apart then at least offer an alternative. For the record I believe alcohol should be banned, or at least not served to those who are under 30. Hopefully by that age you will have developed some self control and awareness of your actions. If not then you're a waste of skin and air.

 

[Lunar Scorpion]

Once I have the capital I'm off and you lot can carry on either ignoring the deterioration around your or enjoying it, whatever you choose.

I am neither ignoring it or enjoying it...

For the record I believe alcohol should be banned, or at least not served to those who are under 30. Hopefully by that age you will have developed some self control and awareness of your actions. If not then you're a waste of skin and air.

For the record, I have never been involved with the police or NHS (I think it is a given that I cannot afford private healthcare) due to alcohol. I don't go around picking fights, I don't go around making a fool of myself (no more than I have done when I've been sober anyway).

About three years ago I was assaulted by a man who was clearly over 30, so (what I assume is) your argument falls down a bit there... I personally believe that the only reason I am so responsible (admittedly not perfect!) with my drinking now is because I have had a good few years experience of alcohol. It's like riding a bike, you need practice to learn and you might fall off a couple of times before you feel confident; but once you get used to it you don't tend to fall off again. It's the same with driving: the problem is not with young drivers, it's with inexperienced drivers.

 

[db]

I can barely afford broadband let alone sky and an alcohol problem ... For the record I believe alcohol should be banned, or at least not served to those who are under 30.

hold on, aren't you 22? how would you support your "alcohol problem" if you were banned from buying it? i'm sure you will answer that you would happily forgoe it, for the greater good.. presumably because you would be happy relaxing with a spliff instead (your comments imply a soft opinion of cannabis; apologies if this is not the case).. so despite your hard-right conservative views, you are happy breaking drug laws?

it is clear that you live by your own moral code, which is a good thing imo and far more sensible than obeying the cold hard letter of the law in exacting detail.. however, you make the mistake of thinking that your morals and opinions are absolute fact and you have a hard time understanding why others deviate from your path!

 

[DaveDon'tRave]

What an incredible thread this is; social commentary, discussion and debate. It’s interesting and f**king comedy in one – beautiful.

The comment below only relates to the nature of the threads origins and the idea of working as a contribution to society.

It is interesting that most of the political leanings are virtually all to the right; hard-line, tough talking ideas to set the country straight and f**king-ay, why not?

It would have been interesting though if this thread was titled “Chief Executives Who Pay Themselves Obscene Bonuses and Pay their Employees Toffee†or “Huge Corporations who Exploit Thousands of Workers off the back of the Capitalist Free Market†or “Politicians Who Siphon off Government Money into Their Own Back Pocketsâ€.

These people exist as do those at the bottom end of the society because of the way this country has evolved and the desires of the people of this country – by that I don’t mean socio-political desires – but what we aspire for and to be.

If I look at a some smelly, lazy, fat, ill looking dole blagging excuse for an artist that doesn’t even make ‘Art’, or a pub dwelling, track-suited mouthy tit who hasn’t played sport in a decade – I do not say “What a geezer, I want to be like himâ€. I say “Look at that smelly, lazy, fat, ill looking dole blagging excuse for a person†and think – ‘Thank fook I’m not like him, but while I’m at it what a c**t taking my tax and wasting it on cheap beans and Emmerdale, what cheek, they should bring back National Service.â€

However, if I see some chap in a nice car, nice suit, big house, gorgeous lady on his arm I say to my self “Look at that snobby tw*t, who does he think he is, I bet he’s not happy, I bet he’s miserable – why does he get all that nice stuff – what a c**t he think’s he’s the bollocks smug t*tâ€.

But that’s total pants really. What I want is a nice car, nice house and gorgeous lady on my arm. (Aside; Not the suit though, I do not do and do not want a job that necessitates a suit.)

So the way I see this idea is that corrupt monkeys like them are less visible or certainly not as easy target as ‘dossers’ etc.

My point being, that Mr Big might well just be as equally bigger c**t as the former.

They both take money out of people’s pockets in an equally snide way.

They are both products of our society, one says I want MORE for nothing, the other says I want SOMETHING for nothing. I don’t know which is worse but…

Just a thought.

 

[shoes]

hold on, aren't you 22? how would you support your "alcohol problem" if you were banned from buying it? i'm sure you will answer that you would happily forgoe it, for the greater good.. presumably because you would be happy relaxing with a spliff instead (your comments imply a soft opinion of cannabis; apologies if this is not the case).. so despite your hard-right conservative views, you are happy breaking drug laws?

You are right in assuming I smoke cannabis. I am also a very very occasional drinker, and by that I mean probably once or twice a month. And certainly never to excess. In te last 24 months I think I have got totally munted twice, both a parties away from the public. And as far as I am aware I didn't cause any trouble.

I don't believe cannabis should be illegal, especially if drugs such as alcohol and nicotine are legal. It makes no sense to me. Ideally I'd like to see alcohol banned altogether but they would be riots all the way from the lambrini drinking baby machines all the way to the upper eshelons (sp?) of society who drink stuff so expensive I can't even pronounce it.

Just as a juxtaposition, would you rather be surrounded by 20 stoners or 5 drunks? I break several laws but they all have one thing in common, they are victimless crimes. I don't see how smoking cannabis affects anyone elses life, in the same way I don't see how using ecstacy is dangerous unless you don't follow the instructions. Cocaine I'm in two minds about, I think certain types of people shouldn't be allowed it. As someone who has used it before I can say I enjoyed it and managed not to stab anyone.

it is clear that you live by your own moral code, which is a good thing imo and far more sensible than obeying the cold hard letter of the law in exacting detail.. however, you make the mistake of thinking that your morals and opinions are absolute fact and you have a hard time understanding why others deviate from your path!

You are absolutely right in this summing up.

I have a hard time understanding why some people have no ambition, no need to succeed in whatever it is that makes them happy. I find it almost impossible to understand how some people can teach their kids that living on a council estate living off the state all your life is a good choice? I also don't see why I should have to pay for it. Like many of you on here I work hard and am not paid my worth, but thats not stoppping my trying to do better, earn more money, have a happier life, get into a line of work which I would enjoy. As a person of morals I find it hard to accept that people would happily live off others not giving a f**k where the money came from as long as its there.

I also have a hard time understanding why so many people are so liberal with those who take the piss and screw them on a daily basis. Especially those who understand basic economics and why they are so poor despite their wage slips suggesting they earn £20k a year.