Glam
Mad Cat Woman
So where abouts do you go a huntin then?
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The moral argument of eating meat & dairy
- Thread starter Mikinton
- Start date
LongGoneFarAway
A few posts under my belt
Mainly Central & Western Massachusetts & New Hampshire.
United57
Well-Known Forumite
So your not for gun control then?
PS we have Cameron and he is doing a super job even better than Blair.
LongGoneFarAway
A few posts under my belt
With a few exceptions, such as mental illness or criminal convictions for violent offences, No, I'm very much against gun control.
Just about everyone I know over here is a gun owner of one type or another. Most of them are like me, owners of hunting rifles/shotguns, but a few do carry handguns.
With regards to the subject of this thread, there is a culture of hunting over here and many people I know do hunt for their own meat. And contrary to how the media (BBC) love to portray them as 'gun totin red necks', they are overwhelmingly well educated, responsible and above all, very ethical hunters.
I know some people may have a genuine problem with hunting and meat eating in general, but I get a little PO'd at those that criticise hunting, whilst enjoying a Sunday roast just before taking a nap on their leather couch!
tek-monkey
wanna see my snake?
Is it better to kill mammals for meat, or kill insects to protect vegetative crops? how many insects equate to one cow, or one chicken? If I allow ants to live in my garden, can I offset those lives against cows?
gon2seed
(and me! - Ed)
In my oppinion seeing as you asked:- Far preferable to kill an insect, and that is on a biological assesment on a hierarchicy of sentient animals. But beyond that, what about 'fruitarians' who willl only eat plants if the parent plant has not had to be destroyed?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fruitarianism
proactive
Enjoying a drop of red.
I wonder what the life expectancy of a Fruitarian is?
tek-monkey
wanna see my snake?
gon2seed
(and me! - Ed)
Can't see any reason that it should be less than a Vegan. The one I knew had to be very organised around meals, was on the surface very fit, healthy and happy, but might have been seen as a bit obsessive; one of the characteristics that comes with this dietry persuation! He knew all the dietry requirements of an adult, to a post grad scientific level, and covered every food group' apart from meat & milk. I imagine protein may be a bit more challenging, not sure about Quorn, Soya, Textured Vegetable Protein, but where there is a will. Must need an imaginative and open mind, but can't see any reason why it is not more than the average person's annimal fat filled , protein rich, calorie inflated slop. Certainly isn't for me, I enjoy my Lacto Veggie slop far too much.
proactive
Enjoying a drop of red.
gon2seed
(and me! - Ed)
And don't get down wind from them either! PARP!
gon2seed
(and me! - Ed)
Went to Asda to purchase 'The Venerable Mrs Seed' some multi-packs of fat free yoghurt. 2 Weight Watchers one Ada's Own. In two of the Weight W's one's there was gelatine and not the others, or the Asda's own. Can't imagine why Black Cherry & peach needs gelatine and others don't! 
(Serves you right for being a wierdo! Ed)
Seedling Senior, will eat them as he has starting consuming flesh, too difficult to carter for others in shared house at Uni'. The other two seedlings are a lot more comitted to a vegetarian life style than me! I've paid for the feckers, the damage is done, so I have eat one already!
Waste not want not! & I am sorry mum, you have profited from enough of our purchasing mistakes recently!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gelatin
(Serves you right for being a wierdo! Ed)Seedling Senior, will eat them as he has starting consuming flesh, too difficult to carter for others in shared house at Uni'. The other two seedlings are a lot more comitted to a vegetarian life style than me! I've paid for the feckers, the damage is done, so I have eat one already!
Waste not want not! & I am sorry mum, you have profited from enough of our purchasing mistakes recently!http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gelatin
henryscat
Well-Known Forumite
What use does such a comparison have? You can't, in my view, say x number of species equates to the lives of y number of species.
I'd turn round your first question and say it is far better to not feed our crops to animals and to instead feed them directly to humans, thus feeding more people...
In terms of killing insects, depending on where you're coming from, pesticides lead to all sorts of problems from hazards to human health to causing resistance in insect populations that start to become immune. All living things are part of a balance, so if you start eliminating insects, you deprive animal populations (e.g. birds) of a food source.
tek-monkey
wanna see my snake?
But insects are killed, in massive numbers, to ensure food is edible (desirable?) by humans. We don't bother as much if its animal feed, so less lives lost overall. Therefore, on a purely murdering of animals aspect, I can't see meat eating as an issue.
I personally subscribe to age'd parents idea that some lives are worth more than others, its just that I place all animals in the 'edible' section. Horses for courses (starter, main and possibly even desert).
I personally subscribe to age'd parents idea that some lives are worth more than others, its just that I place all animals in the 'edible' section. Horses for courses (starter, main and possibly even desert).
age'd parent
50,000th poster!
Huh? While I may believe that my life is worth more than others, I don't think I told any one that!
but just for the record I am an omnivore, if it's dead and it tastes ok, i will eat it.
henryscat
Well-Known Forumite
A lot of insects are beneficial to crops... Bees would be somewhere near the top of the list and their numbers are declining worryingly.
On your second sentence, I don't follow at all what you are saying.
Don't follow that sentence either......
On what basis do you assign value? What are your defining criteria / characteristics for valuing a life whether human or animal?
henryscat
Well-Known Forumite
Implicit in veganism is a more equal valuing of animal life, and I would say most vegans would want to minimise their impact on non-animal life too. Vegans (or most anyway) don't eat honey for instance.
The central nervous system criteria defines animals, so my question (which I might have qualified better) was really on what basis do you place a different value on different animals? (we are animals too!).
I'd shortened Tek's quote where he said:
, so had taken the context to be animals.TekMonkey said:
My brain is a bit on fire though - long day.
tek-monkey
wanna see my snake?
I guess I was just wondering if every life has the same value? Its an odd concept to me, as I see a sliding scale of giving a damn. Don't get me wrong, I don't even kill spiders, but they matter less to me than say a cat does. I still place all animals in the category of possible target for consumption, with an emphasis on taste.