The Homeless man outside iceland

[Glam]

How is he selfish? You don't have a clue why he is homeless?
I also think the opinions of the handful of people on this Forum matter.
He isn't ruining the livelihoods of local business either. Just cos he doesn't fit in 'the norm' of what folk do, YOU want him moved on. You're a bloody nimby. And yes, wow I swore.
I'll tell you sumat else to. If this poor sod is sat outside Iceland tomorrow after I've finished work, I shall buy him a cup of tea and sumat to eat.
I shall even have a look if we have any spare bedding, sleeping bags etc. There for the grace of God go I.

 

[ConcernedCitizen]

How is he selfish? You don't have a clue why he is homeless?
I also think the opinions of the handful of people on this Forum matter.
He isn't ruining the livelihoods of local business either. Just cos he doesn't fit in 'the norm' of what folk do, YOU want him moved on. You're a bloody nimby. And yes, wow I swore.
I'll tell you sumat else to. If this poor sod is sat outside Iceland tomorrow after I've finished work, I shall buy him a cup of tea and sumat to eat.
I shall even have a look if we have any spare bedding, sleeping bags etc. There for the grace of God go I.

My point was to the average person on the street not ourselves. (you seem to be confused).

'He isn't ruining the livelihoods of local business either.' Where is your evidence for this statement? I have talked first hand to those working in these establishment and they all say the same thing apart from 'the hours are long' which is that 'he scares customers away from the area'.

No surprise in your comment. Instead of bringing up any constructive arguments you rely on name calling. The lowest form of debating.

 

[ConcernedCitizen]

http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz/quiz.php

No surprise. I am a liberal leaning libertarian.

 

[db]

Actually I reckon poor literacy skills probably do more harm to our 'very local fragile recovery' than any individual homeless person ever could.

To be fair, @ConcernedCitizen has made several posts now and his grammar & general literacy is near enough spot on, certainly better than many of the regulars here & elsewhere, so to jump on this one little slip is a bit of a poor attempt at rebuking his point..

It's easy for everyone to take the moral high ground, as we sit in our houses, away from trouble, but as wmr said I bet most of us would think slightly differently if there was a smelly, antisocial tramp right outside our front door every single day.. Or, in the case of the OP, outside work, preventing people from going in..

I'm not saying I wholly agree with him, I'm just saying I bet you're all big hypocrites if you were being truly honest with yourself

Oh, and ConcernedCitizen, ignore John Marwood.. He's basically an internet troll who only ever makes useless, cryptic posts, who likes to think he's better than us proles because we can't be bothered to understand him..

 

[proactive]

To be fair, @ConcernedCitizen has made several posts now and his grammar & general literacy is near enough spot on, certainly better than many of the regulars here & elsewhere, so to jump on this one little slip is a bit of a poor attempt at rebuking his point..

You have either misunderstood my point or I expressed it badly. The point is that poor literacy levels are more damaging to our 'very local fragile recovery' (apart from a missing comma, there is no error there) than a homeless man sleeping rough could ever be.

 

[flossietoo]

To be fair, @ConcernedCitizen has made several posts now and his grammar & general literacy is near enough spot on, certainly better than many of the regulars here

Near enough in the sense of quite far away.

 

[ConcernedCitizen]

To be fair, @ConcernedCitizen has made several posts now and his grammar & general literacy is near enough spot on, certainly better than many of the regulars here & elsewhere, so to jump on this one little slip is a bit of a poor attempt at rebuking his point..

It's easy for everyone to take the moral high ground, as we sit in our houses, away from trouble, but as wmr said I bet most of us would think slightly differently if there was a smelly, antisocial tramp right outside our front door every single day.. Or, in the case of the OP, outside work, preventing people from going in..

I'm not saying I wholly agree with him, I'm just saying I bet you're all big hypocrites if you were being truly honest with yourself

Oh, and ConcernedCitizen, ignore John Marwood.. He's basically an internet troll who only ever makes useless, cryptic posts, who likes to think he's better than us proles because we can't be bothered to understand him..

Thanks. I would be none the wiser about John Marwood. He seemed legit but I am very new to this forum.

 

[Glam]

My point was to the average person on the street not ourselves. (you seem to be confused).

'He isn't ruining the livelihoods of local business either.' Where is your evidence for this statement? I have talked first hand to those working in these establishment and they all say the same thing apart from 'the hours are long' which is that 'he scares customers away from the area'.

No surprise in your comment. Instead of bringing up any constructive arguments you rely on name calling. The lowest form of debating.

Where is your evidence that he is hurting local business? We only have your word for this.
I ask you again, where do you intend to move him too? Stone? Stoke?

 

[db]

I ask you again, where do you intend to move him too?

The police regularly move on groups of youths from hanging about outside shops/precincts/etc. Hell, they even have those "mosquito" devices designed to deliberately damage their hearing in the hope it stops them loitering. Why is this any different?

I agree with every single point in this thread about how it's not very pleasant, could happen to any of us, not very compassionate, etc. but I bet very few of you who are condemning poor newbie @ConcernedCitizen would put up with a smelly vagrant outside your door every single day of your life..

 

[ConcernedCitizen]

Where is your evidence that he is hurting local business? We only have your word for this.
I ask you again, where do you intend to move him too? Stone? Stoke?

Why doesn't he just live in Stafford? Somewhere not affecting local businesses?

I would happily see this man housed and not living on the street but that's not the situation we have.

 

[Glam]

I'm not here to row with anyone @db. There doesn't seem to be any empathy from the op for this man. There is not one single shred of evidence presented that he is harming local business. Instead of saying "Let's move this man on" Shouldn't it be "Can we offer him any help out of his situation?"
For all any of us know, he may be unwilling to accept the help on offer.

 

[Frontal]

Yeah, I mean the far greater numbers of homeless around major city centers has really impacted on how popular they are, right ? They're basically empty.
/sarcasm

If they were causing a public nuisance, or breaking laws, then the businesses should call the police and have them moved along. If their only real crime is been unsightly, then as far as I'm concerned you can go swivel.

=====================================
But I shall try and be constructive here.

The simple sad fact of the matter is that the poor and homeless are largely invisible. If you think seeing them is a problem ... then I have news for you, you're the problem, not them.

 

[Frontal]

(in retrospect I realize that video was not the full length one, which I couldn't find, where for the first minute the guys is dressed as a homeless person asking for money and everyone just ignores him)

 

[Lunar Scorpion]

This is brilliant! I don't feel any need to respond to ConcernedCitizen as it's pretty much all been said by others, so I just need to call him a cockwomble or some other insult beginning with c maybe...

John Marwood may be a troll (think it was db who said it, can't be arsed to find the post again), but I find he sometimes makes a hell of a lot of sense!

 

[Frontal]

With a bit of a break, I remembered the following article.

http://www.nationofchange.org/utah-ending-homelessness-giving-people-homes-1390056183

To roughly summarize for people who don't want to read:
- Utah reduced its homelessness by 78% when nationally the rate had increased.
- They did this by giving the homeless homes. For free.
- The average cost per year after hospital and jailtime is $16,670.
- Giving them a small apartment and a case worker costs $11000

Naturally, many will balk at the idea of giving away free houses, but essentially they did up a bunch of derelict/abandoned houses, thus ridding themselves of two issues at once. It was smart, and it worked. It's just unpopular in a capitalist society.

So, in answer to the original questioned posed about what should be done about the homeless in "homeless alley" (seriously I have never heard anyone call it that) ... give them a home.

Problem solved.

 

[littleme]

This is a completely situation to what we have here in Stafford. The United States don't have the system which we have here in the United Kingdom to deal with this problem. For example, Chicago is a very big city with Crime figures that would make your eyes water and almost a non existent welfare system. The main issue is that this individual in Stafford is in the wrong location, I am not judging his circumstance, why he is where his but only take in mind that there are a lot of peoples jobs riding our very local fragile recovery after a long recession and the only thing I would ask you to consider is that individual go elsewhere and not put people's livelihoods at stake.

WOW! A real live NIMBY!

 

[That-Crazy-Rat-Lady]

Am I alone in thinking that the homeless man is part of Stafford?
There has always been some great characters in the town center (I believe there is a thread dedicated to it)
Stafford has character and charm and I love it!

One homeless man is not jeopardizing the jobs of hundreds - that's possibly the most ludicrous thing I've ever heard!
Argos/ Iceland / Wilcos will close down when some big wig in an office miles away who doesn't know the name of a single employee in the store looks at a couple of flow charts and decides that he'll take capital - close them down and buy a summer yacht instead!

Nothing to do with one single individual!

I suggest if you have a problem with the gentleman in question you approach him and raise your concerns.

 

[wmrcomputers]

Out of curiosity though, why IS it always town centres? I'm not just referring to the local situation here but every town in the Country.

Like I say, talking from experience I've spent a few weeks homeless before but I myself didn't sleep or hang out in a town centre out of respect for businesses - so in a small way I respect part of the point that ConcernedCitizen is making. I'm in no way however saying they should be moved on or out - it's a genuine situation that any of us could find ourselves in.
Maybe the homeless feel safer in a town centre where they know there are cameras and a large amount of passers-by to feel reasonably safe. Just wondering what peoples thoughts are.

Maybe my few weeks on the streets wasn't enough for me to loose my sense of compassion for business owners. Maybe not long enough to become desperate enough to be seen by hundreds that may take pity and give me food or money. I was lucky, and I mean REALLY lucky enough to be overheard talking about shelters etc. with a recently made homeless girl in a cafe when an elderly couple sitting nearby came up to us to chat. They lived in an old 12 bed B&B that they only used then as a bungalow, and kindly gave us rooms at £20 per week until we got on our feet. Through them I also got recommended for a job and resumed a normal life within a matter of weeks. I've no doubt that without them my life may have very well turned out far different to how it is now.

 

[littleme]

Out of curiosity though, why IS it always town centres? I'm not just referring to the local situation here but every town in the country.

Maybe its the need to stay near to people, to feel that you are still close to someone/anyone & part of a 'pack'. Homeless people rarely become homeless by choice, more often by circumstance & often because people don't know how to get help from the 'system', they become homeless because they have no-one left to turn to & maybe staying in public view helps them to feel that they 'belong' in some small way. The smallest of smiles from a stranger can be the most uplifting thing in the world to a homeless person.
I know this as I have also been homeless.
Don't judge everyone you pass by by their outside shell.

 

[PeterD]

Following on from Glams lead I think next time I am in town and see him I will also furnish him with a bite to eat and a drink.