Atheism

Withnail

Well-Known Forumite
dangerousdave said:
.. and if any athiests can answer one question in a reasonable manner i will both instantly

1) become an athiest...
Old habits die hard, eh?

I feel no need to convert you, brother.
 

Jenksie

Well-Known Forumite
"Why are you an Atheist?" - question put to Ricky Gervais.

His answer, "it's the way God made me".
 

Jenksie

Well-Known Forumite
Hetairoi said:
Hetairoi said:
Science is often as bad as religion you believe it (or not) just because someone told you so!

How do you know the earth is really round, have you personally been into space and seen it or have you just believed somthing you have been told?
That was only used as an example, maybe a little too obvious an example!
Firstly people don't just believe things because they have been "told so". There is the capacity for logical thought, memory, deduction and just pure instinct. I don't need the laws of Physics explained to me to understand that Fire is hot, Speed is dangerous, ice is cold etc. It can be explained and clarrified if necessary but often isn't. (Unlike God).

I'm wondering what current incontravertable Scientific fact any sane person could dispute to prove your point? Smoking is Healthy?, Light doesn't exist? Food is unecessary?

Only thing I can think of is the current global warming debate - and all agree it's happening the debate seems to be about the causes and the speed.
 

MyCult

SEO to the FACE
Hetairoi said:
Science is often as bad as religion you believe it (or not) just because someone told you so!

How do you know the earth is really round, have you personally been into space and seen it or have you just believed somthing you have been told?
This is so wrong it made my brain hurt.

In science thing are believed because someone PROVED them with EVIDENCE.

In religion things are believed because someone told you so (with 0 evidence).

The two thing are so painfully different. feck it. Bored now.
 

tek-monkey

wanna see my snake?
Withnail said:
So here's the question: how difficult is it to understand that to not believe in X does not ipso facto mean to believe in Y?

A lack of belief does not a belief system make.
But you have a belief, a belief that no god exists. I don't have that, I don't believe he does or he doesn't. Bit like an old school Lib Dem, sitting on the fence trying not to annoy either side too much....
 

shoes

Well-Known Forumite
MyCult said:
Hetairoi said:
Science is often as bad as religion you believe it (or not) just because someone told you so!

How do you know the earth is really round, have you personally been into space and seen it or have you just believed somthing you have been told?
This is so wrong it made my brain hurt.

In science thing are believed because someone PROVED them with EVIDENCE.

In religion things are believed because someone told you so (with 0 evidence).

The two thing are so painfully different. feck it. Bored now.
Don't bother cult, people who hold religious views are tedious and just loop around the same tired, worn out arguments which have absolutely no logical basis whatsoever. It saddens me that more of this planet holds a belief in a flying spaghetti monster than not - frightening even.

I have never been able to get my head around faith - it just seems so.... illogical.

Oh, and FWIW - I'm Jesus III (little known fact - bob marley was the second coming of Jesus)

Edit... and Chris Rock genuinely is the thirteenth Apostle....
 

Withnail

Well-Known Forumite
tek-monkey said:
But you have a belief, a belief that no god exists.
Semantics, dear boy - a cunning linguist could lick you into shape.

Do i not believe in god, or believe in not god?
 

Jenksie

Well-Known Forumite
MyCult said:
Hetairoi said:
Science is often as bad as religion you believe it (or not) just because someone told you so!

How do you know the earth is really round, have you personally been into space and seen it or have you just believed somthing you have been told?
This is so wrong it made my brain hurt.

In science thing are believed because someone PROVED them with EVIDENCE.

In religion things are believed because someone told you so (with 0 evidence).

The two thing are so painfully different. feck it. Bored now.
I was trying to be polite - but like your answer better.
 

henryscat

Well-Known Forumite
shoes said:
I have never been able to get my head around faith - it just seems so.... illogical.
A lot of it comes down to parents indoctrinating children and telling them what to believe at a young age, and that becomes instilled. Result = people holding conflicting beliefs. There's no shortage of religious scientists, who you would think would apply what they have been taught and reach some sensible conclusions.
 

dangerousdave

Well-Known Forumite
MyCult said:
Just to clarify the question: "With the current level of understanding explian everything ever otherwise sky-man being made it?"
to be honest, i've taken a lot on board through this thread, about how this idea of a 'higher being' is entrenched in us from a young age through society, often our family, schooling, etc, and it has got me thinking a lot more about how why we do have that belief. i'm aware that religion does sate a large proportion of the natural questioning of 'why do we exist' which is prevalent in our behaviour, but you do not have to have a belief in religion to have a belief in a 'higher being'. I'd love there to be heaven and hell, it feels nice to think that we will be rewarded for good deeds, and punsihed for not being good. but if i'm honest, i honestly don't know of there is, and unfortunately there's no way of proving it, so i do question that a lot more.

but, for me, the idea of a 'higher being' is a bit more clear cut than the 'heaven and hell' aspect. something cannot of been created from nothing. having said that, one of the 'somethings' that cannot be created form nothing does include the 'higher being', i am fully aware of this

i don't actually know where i'm going with this. i think the only thing that i can take form this is that there's far too many questions that are currently unnanswered for anyone to say categorically that there is not a god or higher being. I also think that for any particular religion to believe that they are the absoloute truth is quite pious
 

Hetairoi

Well-Known Forumite
Jenksie said:
Hetairoi said:
Hetairoi said:
Science is often as bad as religion you believe it (or not) just because someone told you so!

How do you know the earth is really round, have you personally been into space and seen it or have you just believed somthing you have been told?
That was only used as an example, maybe a little too obvious an example!
Firstly people don't just believe things because they have been "told so". There is the capacity for logical thought, memory, deduction and just pure instinct. I don't need the laws of Physics explained to me to understand that Fire is hot, Speed is dangerous, ice is cold etc. It can be explained and clarrified if necessary but often isn't. (Unlike God).

I'm wondering what current incontravertable Scientific fact any sane person could dispute to prove your point? Smoking is Healthy?, Light doesn't exist? Food is unecessary?

Only thing I can think of is the current global warming debate - and all agree it's happening the debate seems to be about the causes and the speed.
You know fire is hot and ice is cold because you have felt the heat or cold, you have proof!
 

Jenksie

Well-Known Forumite
Hetairoi said:
Jenksie said:
Hetairoi said:
That was only used as an example, maybe a little too obvious an example!
Firstly people don't just believe things because they have been "told so". There is the capacity for logical thought, memory, deduction and just pure instinct. I don't need the laws of Physics explained to me to understand that Fire is hot, Speed is dangerous, ice is cold etc. It can be explained and clarrified if necessary but often isn't. (Unlike God).

I'm wondering what current incontravertable Scientific fact any sane person could dispute to prove your point? Smoking is Healthy?, Light doesn't exist? Food is unecessary?

Only thing I can think of is the current global warming debate - and all agree it's happening the debate seems to be about the causes and the speed.
You know fire is hot and ice is cold because you have felt the heat or cold, you have proof!
You seem to have agreed with me and contradicted your earliar post.

Proof.

Evidence.

Reinforced by Scientific data. Proveable, repeatable peer reviewed. Unlike Water into Wine, Immaculate conception and every animal species on earth being convieniently crammed onto a Ferry.
 

Gramaisc

Forum O. G.
Hetairoi said:
You know fire is hot and ice is cold because you have felt the heat or cold, you have proof!
One frosty morning, I found a very useful-looking item in a skip, but a few hundred yards from where I could secrete it safely. I had to carry it with my right hand getting steadily number with the cold, but keeping my left hand safely in my pocket. Having hidden the item securely, I then decided to wash my hands, but thought that it would be best if the water was barely tepid. I then had the very odd sensation of having both hands in the same basin - which was too hot for one and too cold for the other..
 

Withnail

Well-Known Forumite
To the uber-trendy Intelligence Squared debate. The subject: The world needs religion even if it doesn't need God. Alain de Botton and Grayson Perry argue against religion...

Perry appeared in a dashing polka dot dress: "I stand before you, a man in a dress, delivering a lecture," he said. "Nothing unusual about that. It happens in churches across the country every day." Asked by Atkins what could make him believe in God, he said: "Even if God plopped down in front of me, I would take some hard persuading that he existed. I've taken so many drugs in my life that I'd assume my mind had simply, finally, gone."

Asked whether Jesus was the son of God, a wise man or a mad man, De Botton took the Freudian approach. "A borderline schizophrenic, who had issues with his parents – his father in particular," he said.
 

basil

don't mention the blinds
Mmmm, i was informed eons ago that god was us, somehow that makes sense......
 

Hetairoi

Well-Known Forumite
Jenksie said:
Hetairoi said:
Jenksie said:
Firstly people don't just believe things because they have been "told so". There is the capacity for logical thought, memory, deduction and just pure instinct. I don't need the laws of Physics explained to me to understand that Fire is hot, Speed is dangerous, ice is cold etc. It can be explained and clarrified if necessary but often isn't. (Unlike God).

I'm wondering what current incontravertable Scientific fact any sane person could dispute to prove your point? Smoking is Healthy?, Light doesn't exist? Food is unecessary?

Only thing I can think of is the current global warming debate - and all agree it's happening the debate seems to be about the causes and the speed.
You know fire is hot and ice is cold because you have felt the heat or cold, you have proof!
You seem to have agreed with me and contradicted your earliar post.

Proof.

Evidence.

Reinforced by Scientific data. Proveable, repeatable peer reviewed. Unlike Water into Wine, Immaculate conception and every animal species on earth being convieniently crammed onto a Ferry.
Not at all, you have proof of things that you have experienced yourself everything else you are taking someone word for it so it is then up to you to decide whether you belive them or not so religion and science are very similar.

I choose to believe that the world is round but have not seen it for myself so it may be wrong however unlikely.
 

Withnail

Well-Known Forumite
Give it up H - you really are talking the most unutterable twaddle now. When in a hole it is best to stop digging.
 
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