So, this budget then, nobody care?

[basil]

You've never had it so good........

 

[shoes]

The poor will get poorer - of that I am as sure as anything in this world

I'm not being a dick on purpose but I literally cannot envisage this - please explain how you get get poorer than losing your job and being put onto state benefits at a higher income than joe bloggs the shelf stacker. I appreciate your definition of poor has a lot to do with this.

In fact my definition of poor is having to claim anything from the state for any reason other than illness or pension. What's yours?

 

[shoes]

You've never had it so good........

Yes but I've worked for it and am continuing to do so.

Lets hope the investments pay off eh?

EDIT:

What do you call someone who doesnt drink, smoke or drive?

A tax evader!

 

[John Marwood]

The poor will get poorer - of that I am as sure as anything in this world

I'm not being a dick on purpose but I literally cannot envisage this - please explain how you get get poorer than losing your job and being put onto state benefits at a higher income than joe bloggs the shelf stacker. I appreciate your definition of poor has a lot to do with this.

In fact my definition of poor is having to claim anything from the state for any reason other than illness or pension. What's yours?

Oh cheers! A large Irish Malt please,most kind I am sure

 

[Wookie]

VAT rises disproportionately affect the poor. Figures from Save the Children are that the poorest 10% spend 14% of their income on VAT, while for the richest 10% it's only 5%.
I say stick another 2.5% on alcohol. But as an almost teetotaller, I may be biased.

 

[db]

VAT rises disproportionately affect the poor. Figures from Save the Children are that the poorest 10% spend 14% of their income on VAT, while for the richest 10% it's only 5%.

yes, but those are percentages of tiny amounts, so it makes the situation sound worse than it is.. if i were to tell you that i saved 50% of my wages, you would think i must have quite a nest egg.. if it then turned out that i only earned £2, suddenly 50% doesn't sound like so much!

a bump from 17.5% to 20% translates to a tiny amount in real terms.. even if you are buying a new car for £15k, you're still only talking about ~£300 extra - on a £15k purchase!! if a typical person spends £200 a month on VATable goods, that's only an extra £5 a month.. whereas these richest 10% you talk about, say they spend £2000 a month, they get taxed an extra £50, which is a fair old contribution..

zero rated essentials are unaffected by this increase, so it's not like you're taxing the food on their table.. if a few (literally a few) extra quid a month on what are largely luxury purchases can help generate however many billions of pounds, that makes sense to me..

and the proles are always banging on about how fags and booze are "the only little luxuries we have left in life", so there would have been uproar if they bunged more tax on them..

I say stick another 2.5% on alcohol. But as an almost teetotaller, I may be biased.

yeah, i feel the same way about fags, but it's easy to say that from way up in our ivory tower of abstenance innit lol..

 

[tek-monkey]

At least vat taxes everyone, not just the workers.

EDIT: And unless you earn over 30k or so, the rise in personal allowance will cover it.

 

[John Marwood]

What the VAT rise means is a mini boom now

And gloom and despondency in January

hard to see the New Year ever picking up - 2011 will be tough for retail especially but also for the service sector -

 

[Tinkerbell]

I agree with John - there will be gloom and despondency in January

 

[John Marwood]

Anyway - today there is a wonderful nearfullmoon - Orange in colour

and its warm and beautiful - so I think today is to be enjoyed

As many times as possible nanight

 

[tek-monkey]

I agree with John - there will be gloom and despondency in January

With the massive debt we'd run up its due anyway, and the longer we bury our heads in the sand the worse it will get. Its like refusing to open that letter from the inland revenue, thinking if you don't read it you're not in as much trouble (been there, done that!).

There had to be cuts made, I'd be interested to see what should have been cut instead?

 

[John Marwood]

I agree with John - there will be gloom and despondency in January

With the massive debt we'd run up its due anyway, and the longer we bury our heads in the sand the worse it will get. Its like refusing to open that letter from the inland revenue, thinking if you don't read it you're not in as much trouble (been there, done that!).

There had to be cuts made, I'd be interested to see what should have been cut instead?

A few heads of venture capitalists. bankers, mortgage lenders, and the like, none of which has been gaoled for the massive fraud that took and is taking place. Come to think of it not a single prosecution of anyone involved, including tory politians of all colours, has resulted from these crimes

erm, Trident? half the BBC? anyone making profit from essential public services, erm, The Olympic Games, any future bids for fortnightly International sporting events etc etc?

I am sure others will have their opinions on this question

 

[tek-monkey]

As withnail posted in the private eye thread, 100% of people want cuts to services they don't use.

I agree with locking up some of the thieving ***** who caused this mess though, and the banks are the tip of the iceburg.

 

[henryscat]

VAT rises disproportionately affect the poor. Figures from Save the Children are that the poorest 10% spend 14% of their income on VAT, while for the richest 10% it's only 5%.

yes, but those are percentages of tiny amounts, so it makes the situation sound worse than it is.. if i were to tell you that i saved 50% of my wages, you would think i must have quite a nest egg.. if it then turned out that i only earned £2, suddenly 50% doesn't sound like so much!

a bump from 17.5% to 20% translates to a tiny amount in real terms.. even if you are buying a new car for £15k, you're still only talking about ~£300 extra - on a £15k purchase!! if a typical person spends £200 a month on VATable goods, that's only an extra £5 a month.. whereas these richest 10% you talk about, say they spend £2000 a month, they get taxed an extra £50, which is a fair old contribution..

zero rated essentials are unaffected by this increase, so it's not like you're taxing the food on their table.. if a few (literally a few) extra quid a month on what are largely luxury purchases can help generate however many billions of pounds, that makes sense to me...

You need to also factor in that a lot of people's income is more or less static (wage freezes) and what inflation is likely to occur, because obviously as prices rise so does the amount of VAT you pay.

 

[henryscat]

There had to be cuts made, I'd be interested to see what should have been cut instead?

The deficit reduction doesn't all have to come from cuts. It can also come from taxation. We still don't tax those that can afford it anywhere near enough.

 

[shoes]

Sounds like you want everyone to have the same regardless of what they do, how hard they work or what skills they gain.

Get stuffed.

 

[henryscat]

Get stuffed.

In Russia the poor are now worse off than they were under communism.

 

[basil]

surely we have some assets worth a bob or two that can be flogged off?........

 

[shoes]

surely we have some assets worth a bob or two that can be flogged off?........

Prince Philip?

 

[henryscat]

surely we have some assets worth a bob or two that can be flogged off?........

Yep, the Channel Tunnel Rail Link is about to get flogged. More short termism. It generates an income, but lets flog it for about a fifth of what it cost to build...